#114 – Eileen White, Ph.D.: Autophagy, fasting, and promising new cancer therapies

Guest
Eileen White
Read time
~4 min
Uploaded
9 Jul 2020
Duration
1:58:54
Views
53.5K
OPEN ON YOUTUBE ↗

KEYPOINTS

  • 01

    Eileen White found autophagy by accident, through apoptosis

    Eileen White, of the Rutgers Cancer Institute of New Jersey, did her postdoc with Bruce Stillman at Cold Spring Harbor. She was given an adenovirus oncogene and found it was a viral version of BCL-2, a human oncogene that blocks apoptosis (programmed cell death). Cells that couldn't commit suicide survived even in buffer with no nutrients. Explaining how led her lab, in the early 1990s, into autophagy, then barely studied in mammals.

  • 02

    Apoptosis is a tidy, tumour-suppressing death

    Unlike necrosis, where cells burst and inflame surrounding tissue, apoptosis breaks a cell down in a controlled way and packages it into apoptotic bodies. Macrophages clear these, which limits inflammation and may help antigen presentation. p53 activates apoptosis-promoting proteins such as PUMA and NOXA, which antagonise BCL-2. Common hotspot mutations of p53 can both disable it and actively promote cancer, so the old 'loss versus gain of function' teaching is too black-and-white.

  • 03

    Autophagy is the cell's recycling system

    Under stress such as starvation, cells engulf their own components in autophagosomes and send them to lysosomes to be broken down for fuel and building blocks. Exercise induces autophagy strongly, and muscle needs it because exercise damages muscle. White points out that much of a cell's mass is protein, a point David Sabatini has made, so recycling proteins is a major supply route.

  • 04

    Autophagy is essential to life

    Mice lacking the autophagy genes ATG5 or ATG7 are born but die in the newborn period. When White's lab deleted autophagy in adult mice, they died of neurodegeneration within two to three months. If those mice were fasted, they were all dead within 16 hours. The brain and liver depend on autophagy for long-term protection.

  • 05

    Tumours depend on autophagy more than the host does

    In mice with lung cancer driven by RAS, deleting an essential autophagy gene throughout the body killed the tumour before the mouse. A newer model from a former trainee and a UK lab can switch autophagy off and back on, and normal tissues show a remarkable capacity to recover. That suggests treatment could use a temporary window.

  • 06

    Some cancers are especially autophagy-dependent

    RAS-driven cancers, BRAF V600E lung cancers and melanomas, and homologous-recombination-deficient breast cancers appear particularly sensitive. Lung cancers that have lost LKB1, the tumour suppressor that activates AMPK, can't turn on this protective response to low energy, a mouse model made by Jessie Guo, now at Rutgers.

  • 07

    The paradox: autophagy prevents cancer yet feeds established tumours

    By clearing damaged components, autophagy buffers the stress that can lead to cancer. Once a tumour exists, it uses autophagy to survive. White cautions against equating caloric restriction with autophagy. Caloric restriction may limit tumours partly through other routes.

  • 08

    No one knows the dose of fasting

    Attia is sure that after about seven days of water-only fasting, autophagy is 'fully cranked', and that a 12-hour gap does nothing. Where between those it switches on is unknown. That leaves his own protocols (3 days monthly, 5 or 7 days quarterly) as guesses. Measuring autophagic flux requires blocking lysosomal breakdown with bafilomycin or hydroxychloroquine and tracking the conversion of LC3-I to LC3-II, so blood-cell measurements in fasting people only give clues. George Cahill's classic 40-day fasting study showed that the first, second and third 24 hours are metabolically very different. The open question is whether 48–72 hours gets you 80% of the benefit or only 20%.

  • 09

    Metabolic tracing could answer this

    White proposes labelling mice with carbon-13 or nitrogen-15 tracers to see how different tissues use nutrients during fasts of different lengths. That could define the roughly 50 metabolites or proteins that track autophagy, and later test them in humans. It's possible now, she says, in a way it wasn't 20 years ago.

  • 10

    Delaying chronic disease is the real target

    Attia argues that the animal and centenarian data point to delaying the onset of chronic disease, which by his analysis accounts for 82% of US deaths over 50. He notes that for solid tumours, median survival has improved by less than about a year since 1970.

EXAMPLES

  • 01

    A Lynch syndrome patient on Keytruda

    A friend of Attia's with Lynch syndrome developed unresectable pancreatic adenocarcinoma wrapped around his mesenteric vessels. A paper in the New England Journal of Medicine on mismatch-repair-deficient tumours led Attia to push for the anti-PD-1 drug Keytruda through a trial. Five years later he was disease-free.

  • 02

    Mutation burden and immunotherapy

    Melanoma responds well to CTLA-4 and PD-1 blockade because it carries so many mutations. Yet some high-mutation tumours don't respond. White's NIH grant builds mouse models with low, medium and high mutation burden to test how blocking autophagy affects the response.

  • 03

    The 2016 Nobel

    The Nobel Prize for autophagy went to work in yeast that White's field then extended to mammals.

  • 04

    The Warburg debate

    Attia cites the 2009 Science paper by Matt Vander Heiden, Lewis Cantley and Craig Thompson, which argued that cancer cells' heavy glucose use serves biosynthesis, not just energy.

OTHER RELEVANT

  • 01

    Exercise as an autophagy inducer

    Exercise is a potent, low-risk trigger. White says it's less of a dosing problem than fasting, since most people just need more.

  • 02

    Treat fasting protocols as unproven

    The duration and frequency of fasts are educated guesses until autophagy can be measured in humans. The conversation keeps the claim tied to named mechanisms, numbers, and caveats so a listener can act or ask better questions without flattening the nuance.

  • 03

    Inherited risk still matters

    Good health practices don't erase a BRCA mutation. Screening still matters. The conversation keeps the claim tied to named mechanisms, numbers, and caveats so a listener can act or ask better questions without flattening the nuance.

  • 04

    Watch for autophagy-blocking cancer trials

    Combining autophagy inhibition with targeted drugs or immunotherapy is an active research direction, but still experimental. The conversation keeps the claim tied to named mechanisms, numbers, and caveats so a listener can act or ask better questions without flattening the nuance.